Another interesting Q ... Grass or Hard surface runway?

Just was thinking about Duxford, looks like grass runways are more appealing to Spitfires, Hurricanes, and many other warbirds. Whats the consensis from some of you warbird pilots?, do you like grass strips over hard surface runways? Does everything change when landing or taking off grass surfaces? Are there just too many options per warbird type? Any warbird that would be a bad choice for grass strips and vise versa? Seems spitfires and 109's would be better off operating from grass, opposed to P-51's, P-39's being better off on hard surfaces.

[krlang]

The cub guy I talked to landed on the grass to save the tires.

You know how tough those cub tires are to get changed.

[Jack Cook]

You know how tough those cub tires are to get changed.

Probably not has hard has B-25 tires
Grass is a lot more fun but there are usually houses close by the runway
Some lucky bastards like JCW live on a grass strip with all their antique biplanes

[jaybird]

I would imagine most, if not all, taildragger pilots will tell you they'll take grass anyday, except when things are soggy. A little less "grab" with a side load on the tire while rolling makes things a bit more pleasant between the wire running from your feet to your brain (and associated sweat glands).

[Michel C-GNCJ]

I cannot speak for warbirds but tailwheel aircraft in general are much happier on grass than asphalt. Makes landing them much more forgiving and less twichy.

AND, so much more enjoyable ! I just recently moved my home base to a grass strip and my '48 Cessna 140 is much happier there. Much better both for the plane, and the pilot's spirit

[coldaffyduck]

One thing to remember is that grass is a lot more forgiving than concrete when it comes to landings. But another thing you have to look at is tire loading. With an aircraft like the Tracker we had, we didn't take it into any grass strips because the gear was close in together supporting a lot of weight, in other words it had a real small footprint. Where as our C-60, a C-47, or most of your Air Force fighters had a wide footprint so the weight was desipated a lot better. Sometimes that doesn't always work though as in several years ago at Reading I remember "Memphis Belle" make some real nice trenches for the infantry.

[Trey Carroll]

When I was flying the T-6, I got to do a grass strip and Indianapolis International, and the grass is waaay better, it gives you a bit of a cushion, much more foregiving than a hard surface.

Trey

[Lynn Allen]

Grass any day...

Lynn

[Michel Lemieux]

K.Week...once told me he had the best of both world.

His runway is extremelly well packed and has quite a remarkable loading capacity.

By using compacted Florida muck ( spelling ? ) and adding some grass, he ended up with a good combination that can handle ( according to the man himself ) all of his current props & could handle quite a few early small jets if needed.

[mrhenniger]

The VWoC Hurricane didn't see too much activity this past summer and went through a set of tires. Tire wear on non-grass runways for the Hurricane are relatively rapid. The Hurri wears a tire off to one side side. Halfway through the useful life the tire are swapped from left to right and right to left to make use of the unworn tread.

Mike

[Pat M]

How about nose gear vs. tail wheel? Could we ever hope to see a P-38 land at Geneseo? A couple of years ago the scuttlebut was that the American Airpower P-47 couldn't come because the insurance co. wouldn't let them land on grass.

[Forgotten Field]

the scuttlebut was that the American Airpower P-47 couldn't come because the insurance co. wouldn't let them land on grass.

It was just that, scuttlebut. The only provisions I have seen in insurance are that the airplane has to be used within the operating limitations of the design. Grass is the tail dragger's friend. I'd prefer to use it any day over hard surface.

[mustangdriver]

I flew the L-21 and a few other aircraft from grass strips. Fun stuff.

[Bill Greenwood]

Grass is a good thing for landing, as long as you don't smoke it before you fly. There are of course many kinds of grass strips, the ideal is like a golf fairway with slightly longer grass. It would cushion the touchdown slightly, dissapate any side load if the touchdown is not straight, and provide extra drag for slowing down without the need for much braking. The extra drag may slow you a bit on the takeoff roll, but a plane like a Spitfire or T-6 has plenty of extra lift or power so it is not much of a problem. The reality is that some grass strips are more like vacant fields and can be pretty bumpy, or sandy. A very heavy plane or one with small tires might not be as good on a soft turf strip. All else equal, a nosewheel plane can land on turf, you just need to keep the weight on the mains so the nose doesn't dip and hit a prop.
The advantage of pavement is that it can be made really smooth, it can allow heavy braking, and less resistance for takeoff, and may dry better after rain or snow.
My insurer asked if I use any grass strips, but there are no restictions on operation.

Last edited by Bill Greenwood on Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[AIRIC]

How about nose gear vs. tail wheel? Could we ever hope to see a P-38 land at Geneseo? A couple of years ago the scuttlebut was that the American Airpower P-47 couldn't come because the insurance co. wouldn't let them land on grass.

Its been done. Jack Shaver flew Tallichet's P-38 into Geneseo. Here are a few photos. Can't remember the year.





Happy Landings,

Eric