Oops, sorry, wrong kind of Clipper
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| Clippers? https://www.warbirdinformationexchange.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19606 |
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| Author: | daveymac82c [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Clippers? |
Hi everyone, I've recently had time to take a step back from my interest in WWII aircraft and operations and have thought to myself "What don't I know a whole lot about?" What came to mind, having been thinking about Stranraers and Cansos earlier in the day, was the civilian operations of large flying boats in the Pacific (to the Orient?). I think they were called Clippers, as in "China Clipper", etc. I know next to nothing about this part of aviation history, but I'm totally fascinated by it. Could someone let me know some good resources for expanding my knowledge on this subject? Are there any good websites for me to check out? Thanks, David |
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| Author: | K5DH [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
The airplane you're probably thinking of is the Boeing 314. They were operated by Pan Am, mainly on Pacific routes. I just did a Google search for "Boeing 314" and it turned enough information to probably keep you busy for weeks. Check it out! Cheers! |
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| Author: | Tulio [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 11:35 pm ] |
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Two, from my library: Pan Am: Gone but not Forgotten Desmond Fairbairn ISBN 0-933449-30-5 Published by Transportation Trails 9698 West Judson Rd. Polo, IL 61064 (815) 946-2341 Pan Am Pioneer A Manager's Memoir Sanford D. Kauffman ISBN 0-89672-357-7 Texas Tech University Press 1995 (800)832-4042 Saludos, Tulio |
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| Author: | Roger Cain [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 11:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Oops, sorry, wrong kind of Clipper
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| Author: | Mike [ Wed Feb 13, 2008 1:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Roger Cain wrote: Oops, sorry, wrong kind of Clipper
Roger, So it is!
David, Here's a link to the website of the Foynes Flying Boat Museum in Ireland, who have recently constructed a full-scale replica of a Boeing 314 Clipper (no originals survive) Hope it's of interest. http://www.flyingboatmuseum.com/ |
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| Author: | daveymac82c [ Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:43 am ] |
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Hey guys, Thanks for the responses. That little blue clipper probably wouldn't be able to make it across the Pacific, but I think it would just as fun to try. And, that replica at the museum in Ireland... That's pretty amazing. Quite the undertaking. Thanks again, I'll take a look at those links and books. 
Cheers, David |
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| Author: | Don Martin [ Wed Feb 13, 2008 7:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Some good Clipper stuff! http://www.flyingclippers.com/ http://www.airliner.net/ http://www.zpub.com/sf/history/sfh-cc.html http://www.hawaiiclipper.com/ Plus there is a museum in Shannon, Ireland, Foynes Flying Boat Museum, dedicated to transatlantic flying boats. www.flyingboatmuseum.com |
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| Author: | Roger Cain [ Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:38 pm ] |
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Mike wrote: Roger Cain wrote: Oops, sorry, wrong kind of Clipper Roger, So it is! Mike, cool, looks like Clipper"s" to me........... |
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| Author: | Forgotten Field [ Sat Feb 16, 2008 12:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Forgotten Planes |
You are forgetting the Martin 130, the Martin Clipper. Pieces exist, and the Russians bought some of them. The Martin Museum has a mock-up of one. |
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| Author: | Tom Moungovan [ Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:51 pm ] |
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My late dad flew the M-130 & B-314 under contract for the USN during the war, mostly between SFO & HNL. First scheduled trip after checkout was on 9/9/43. Between HNL and points in the South Pacific; Palmyra, Noumea, Suva, Aukland, etc., the Martin PBM3 and PB2Y3 were used. Last time he flew one of the Clippers (B-314 # NC18604) was on July 5th, 1944 between HNL & SFO (Honolulu and San Francisco). Logbook states that it had R 2600 type engines for a total of 5400hp. The losses of these aircraft should be well documented. I remember talking with another PanAm retiree at the Watsonville Fly-in in '82 or so...he was on the Clipper that got strafed on Wake & just made it out of there. Said that a few bullets came within inches of crippling the aircraft. |
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| Author: | Canso42 [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 11:17 pm ] |
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DaveyMac, A good flying boat reference book that I have is "Seaplanes & Flying Boats" by Bill Yenne, with illustrations by John Batchelor. BCL Press, New York C. 2003 I've quoted from it a few times on WIX. The book jacket is light blue with a cutaway of Boeing 314 NC18603. Actually I think it was the Martin boats that coined the name 'clippers' and it became applied to all the big Pan Am boats. The only survivor of the Boeing, Martin and Sikorsky big clippers is the VS 44 Sikorsky in a museum in New England. Sure would be cool to see Kermit Weeks Sunderland in action someday! I'll get back to you on the exact location of the Sikorsky. Doug . |
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| Author: | daveymac82c [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 11:43 pm ] |
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Thanks Doug, It sure would be nice to see some big flying boats take to the air again. On one of the websites it has a listing of all the clippers and their eventual demise. It seems like there were quite a few that sank of the coast of different places around the world. What do you think are the odds of any of them being at all recoverable? Have the wrecks even been located? Hmm... I do remember there being a thread on WIX about a Sunderland (I think) that was recently found off the coast of England and there was discussion about the likelihood of a safe recovery of it, but it was mentioned how brittle the airframe would be. I suppose it would be the same for any clipper still located underwater. Cheers, David |
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| Author: | Roger Cain [ Tue Feb 19, 2008 11:57 pm ] |
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The Philippine Clipper crashed above Clear Lake, CA in the mountains, and it's remains that weren't recovered have remained on private property and not been severly picked through like most wreck sites. A group out of Santa Rosa is trying to recover the remainng parts now for a display. |
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| Author: | Canso42 [ Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:38 pm ] |
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Daveymac, Let me know if you think of the name of that site with the clippers' individual fates. I know one Clipper disappeared shortly before the war and one Sikorsky was militarized ('XPS-1' I think. gotta check in on PBY@yahoo for verification.) It hit some floating mega-fod and nosed over violently. Doug. |
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| Author: | daveymac82c [ Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:35 pm ] |
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Hi Doug, The link that I found that has a list of the clippers' demises is: http://www.flyingclippers.com/panam.html A coles notes version reads: - By the 1950's all surviving clippers were scrapped The following are aircraft that crashed, sank, or were lost and whose airframes might still be in existance, but underwater: SIKORSKY S-42 - NC-823M "West Indies Clipper" sank 1947 at Antilla Cuba - NC-824M "Un-named" crashed Port of Spain, Trinidad 1935 - NC-15376(A) "Dominican Clipper" Accident in San Juan Harbor 1941 - NC-16734(B) "Pan American Clipper II" Lost at Pago Pago, Samoa 1938 - NC-16735(B) "Bermuda Clipper" Sunk at Hong Kong Harbor 1941 MARTIN M-130 - NC-14714 "Hawaiian Clipper" Lost east of Manila 1938 - NC-14716 "China Clipper" Crashed, Port of Spain, Trinidad 1945 BOEING B-314 - NC-18601 "Honolulu Clipper" sunk in Pacific Ocean 1945 - NC-18603 "Yankee Clipper" sank River Tagus near Lisbon, Portugal 1943 - NC-18612(A) "Capetown Clipper" sunk by the U.S. Coast Guard 1947 It sure would be nice to find one. Happy hunting to whoever would like a big challenge. Cheers, David |
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