Brunner Winkle Bird mystery part

wacoykc · **Posted:** Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:58 pm

I see that they have put those rotten heel brakes in that you can never get to if you have full rudder in....when will people learn?

Airplanejunkie · **Posted:** Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:58 pm

wacoykc wrote:

I see that they have put those rotten heel brakes in that you can never get to if you have full rudder in....when will people learn?

It seems like after going to all the trouble to chop up the front seat bottom/back like that they'd have put toe brakes in... :roll:

I don't mind the heel brakes in my Bird...they're a little clumsy but OK.....

threepoint · **Joined:** Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:12 pm **Posts:** 14

I flew a Pietenpol with a rudder bar and heel brakes. It was a bit awkward but I really didn't fly it enough to get used to it. The plan on my Bird is to put 30x5 wheels on it with mechanical brakes. I have the rudder bar with the mechanical brakes on it - which helps make it a good argument for going that way.

Baldeagle · **Posted:** Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:05 am

This Bird

has that style rudder bar, it takes a little getting used to, but works OK with the mechanical brakes. Of course steering is more important than braking most of the time, as long as you've got good steering the brakes are secondary (on most airplanes anyway).

-

Airplanejunkie · **Posted:** Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:23 am

threepoint wrote:

I flew a Pietenpol with a rudder bar and heel brakes. It was a bit awkward but I really didn't fly it enough to get used to it. The plan on my Bird is to put 30x5 wheels on it with mechanical brakes. I have the rudder bar with the mechanical brakes on it - which helps make it a good argument for going that way.

In my not so vast Bird experience, I find that I don't really want the brakes until I need to slow for a sharp turn or to keep the taxi speed from building, and then only on pavement. The bigger issue for me is remembering to position my feet so that my toes don't get jammed on the front seat bottom and my heels don't drag the brakes. I haven't flown a Bird with mechanical brakes yet but I really don't see any issues with it.

Jack Cook · **Posted:** Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:13 pm

Jeff sent me some pictures to post showing the pedals/brake set-up on his bird.
I'll post them tomorrow but in the meantime here is what he said.

Quote:

there is a way to get toe brakes and a rudder system that
is a whole lot better than the rudder bar.. Its an adaptation from UC78
rudder pedal parts..

wacoykc · **Posted:** Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:39 pm

Both of our Waco RNF's have mechanical throttle brakes! Push forward for throttle, pull down into your lap for brake. Push the appropriate pedal for differential braking if needed. It's all in the wrist boys! This is an original Waco design by the way. My Waco 10 has a rudder bar and NO brakes and a tailskid. My Cabin has hydraulic toe brakes in place of the original Johnson bar but they are too much brake and do not work if you have full rudder travel. I NEVER use brakes to keep straight on rollout....just use throttle/opposite rudder if need be. Brakes are for taxi only.

Dave Hadfield · **Joined:** Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:31 pm **Posts:** 1672

Andy,

I've heard of those brake-on-the-throttle Wacos. So, does it work OK? Is your hand able to separate the motions out, between brake and throttle?

Mind you, I guess whenever you need brake the throttle is always against the back stop, isn't it? Make the muscle-memory easier.

I know the guys at Vintage Wings have no problem with British brakes, such as on the Spitfire and Hurricane, where you squeeze a lever on the spade-grip stick, and use rudder for differential braking.

All in all, the DH82A Tiger Moth I fly at Edenvale has no brakes and a tailskid, and I find it has great manners on the ground -- as long as you can stay on grass.

Dave

threepoint · **Joined:** Tue Feb 16, 2010 6:12 pm **Posts:** 14

In a perfect world I would leave the tail skid on and forget about brakes...... but...... I figure I will be landing on hard surface from time to time. I really only use brakes to hold a plane for run up or to get a good tight turn while taxing. I like the idea of mechanical brakes so I don't have to deal with any other fluids besides oil and gas! Any mechanical brakes I have used work fine as long as they are adjusted correctly. I suppose I need to put the seats in and see what kind of clearance there is between the seat bottom and floorboards with the bar in place.

I was out at Golden Age Air Museum this last summer and wish I would have had more time to look over their Bird.....

Jack Cook · **Posted:** Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:06 pm

Bird BK N116M

shumaker_dan · **Joined:** Sun Feb 06, 2011 11:56 pm **Posts:** 1

Flight Sergeant,
The item you posted a photo of 2-21-2010 is a vacuum bottle
used with Pioneer Climb Indicator Type 374B. My 1934 Beech B17L
project has one. Do you want to sale the one you have?
Regards,
Dan
http://www.shu-aero.com/

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Brunner Winkle Bird mystery part

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