Planes of Fame 2019

[GRNDP51]

I guess I'm still a little confused.
I know the race planes have race engines in them and the show planes have stock engines in them for the most part.
But why would they put a stock engine in a race plane, I'm never seen one outside of an air race or if it's going for speed record.
I just figured they dusted it off and tuned it up a month or so before the race and then put it back to bed.

Phil

After Reno the engine is typically done! If it’s not completely thrashed, it’s something you don’t want to be flying around on so they put the stocker back in. Race engines are rebuilt every year for Reno as their life span is pretty short.

[GRNDP51]

Tigercat Here Kitty Kitty has arrived with Steve as the ferry pilot. First of Rod’s collection to show up.

[phil65]

I guess I'm still a little confused.
I know the race planes have race engines in them and the show planes have stock engines in them for the most part.
But why would they put a stock engine in a race plane, I'm never seen one outside of an air race or if it's going for speed record.
I just figured they dusted it off and tuned it up a month or so before the race and then put it back to bed.

Phil

After Reno the engine is typically done! If it’s not completely thrashed, it’s something you don’t want to be flying around on so they put the stocker back in. Race engines are rebuilt every year for Reno as their life span is pretty short.

Thanks, I never knew that. I figured it would be difficult to put a stock engine in a race plane because they modify the airframe as well. Kind of like putting regular tires on the Bigfoot truck.

[Lon Moer]

I guess I'm still a little confused.
I know the race planes have race engines in them and the show planes have stock engines in them for the most part.
But why would they put a stock engine in a race plane, I'm never seen one outside of an air race or if it's going for speed record.
I just figured they dusted it off and tuned it up a month or so before the race and then put it back to bed.

Phil

They almost always change to a stock engine when not racing - some crews can do that in a day.
Race engines are very expensive and don't last long, so they are strictly for course action.

[GRNDP51]

Thanks, I never knew that. I figured it would be difficult to put a stock engine in a race plane because they modify the airframe as well. Kind of like putting regular tires on the Bigfoot truck.

The race engine itself is never different enough in shape/size than a stock engine where it won’t fit under the cowling of a stock mustang. Of course racers like Rare Bear don’t just drop a 2800 in since the cowling is fit for the 3350, but the mustang has an advantage of stock and race engines fitting within the cowling. The systems (such as ADI) are always ready in the race airframe, but don’t always NEED to be used with only the race engine. Race/stock configuration is very interchangeable, most if not all stock airframes could run a race engine if they had a cooling system installed to keep it from overheating which I think is pretty sweet!

[GRNDP51]

POF announcing p-47 number 4 next week

[stryper]

So they have stock engine and a race engine for these birds ?
I thought they would just baby the engines unless it was go time...

Phil

I used to think the same, until speaking with Tiger. He mentioned he normally uses a stock motor, or "ferry engine", to fly to Reno, or other engagements. Upon arrival at Reno, his team would swap the ferry engine for the race one, and vice versa, for the trip home. But he has also used his stock motor to fly heat races at Reno, due to his race motor being broken, or the many other issues these temperamental race engines have. Strega, having a heavily modified airframe, is still quite a bit faster than a stock P-51; even with a unmodified engine.

There are others on this forum with eons of knowledge about air racing, racers, and their engines. I'm just a warbird junkie fortunate enough to speak with Tiger one on one at his shop, while I was doing some paint work on another racer back in the early 90s.

[GRNDP51]

Somewhat of an update from what I have gathered:

Just got word Boise Bee and Sneak Attack (desert camo) are coming from Warhawk

4x P-47's, no confirmation on the 4th one yet
3x Sea Furies, I imagine Sanders will send their group
3x P-40's, (POF, Yanks, Warhawk's desert camo), would be surprised if Suzy and even Lulu aren't part of the show
2x P-38's, Skidoo and Honey
I think CAF is planning on sending most of the fleet (F6F, F8F, Zero, Spitfire, PBJ)

P-51's I don't know about potential special attendees, we can assume the usual:
-3 stockers from POF
-Diamondback, Bunny, Boise Bee, Lady Alice confirmed
-Air Racers: Voodoo, Strega, Goldfinger
-Usual Attendees: Straw Boss, Blondie, Speedball, Lady Jo, Kimberly Kaye, Man 'O War?

Here Kitty Kitty, A-26, maybe a Mosquito, everything at POF of course, and still waiting on final confirmation from some of the others (Erickson, Friedkin, Lewis, etc.)

[GRNDP51]

Updated with 3 days to go, arrivals begin tomorrow I believe?

(10) P-51's - Mrs. Virginia (temp. scheme), Boise Bee, Dolly, Wee Willy II, Bunny, Diamondback, Lady Alice, Kimberly Kaye, Blondie, Comfortably Numb

(4) C-47's - Betsy's Biscuit Bomber, Willa Dean, What's Up Doc?, D-Day Doll

(4) P-47's - Dottie Mae, Planes of Fame, Snafu, Hairless Joe

(3) P-40's - Planes of Fame, Yanks Air Museum, Sneak Attack

(3) T-33's - Planes of Fame, Ace Maker III, Palm Springs Air Museum

(2) P-38's - 23 Skidoo, Honey Bunny

(2) F7F's - Here Kitty Kitty, "JC"

(2) B-25's - Photo Fanny (temp. scheme), Pacific Princess

(2) Sea Fury's - N15S, 924G

(1) Spitfire - CAF SoCal

(1) F6F - CAF SoCal

(1) FM-2 - CAF Martlet

(1) A-26 - Sweet Eloise

(1) PB4Y - Gosshawk

Air Race Aircraft:
Voodoo, Strega, Goldfinger, Dreadnought

Planes of Fame Other Aircraft:
Dauntless, Avenger, Corsair, Skyraider, Yak-3, Guardsman, Peashooter, Zero, FW-190, MiG-15

Last edited by GRNDP51 on Sat May 04, 2019 8:11 pm, edited 33 times in total.

[Chris Brame]

Any word on a memorial (display, missing man, etc.) for David Vopat?

[Lon Moer]

Any word on a memorial (display, missing man, etc.) for David Vopat?

End of opening ceremonies both days will have a missing man formation.

[JohnH]

The Mosquito hasn’t flown yet so it won’t be there.

[GRNDP51]

The Mosquito hasn’t flown yet so it won’t be there.

No reason Steve couldn’t fly it a few times tomorrow and fly it to Chino on Thursday

[GRNDP51]

4th P-47 CONFIRMED!!! Hairless Joe from Erickson!!! Forgot she had Invasion Stripes!

[wendovertom]

Man I need to make it again sometime! Sigh - maybe next year.

From an organizer standpoint - the going rate is roughly $5K for a single mustang - so that is $40K in just appearance fees for the mustangs (plus fuel, oil, smoke oil). Going rate for a P-38 appearance is about $10K plus. Granted several of these planes are based at PoF and they have developed relationships so that makes a difference.

Tom P.